Poll: Glorified fanfiction?

[retsuko]

Last night, when I was at book group, I found myself looking at the shelf of "show spin-off" style books and wondering how to deal with the content in them. For example, if I bought an "Angel" novel, would I treat the information included within as canon in the Buffy universe? If yebisu9 reads the Timothy Zahn "Terminator" prequel, can he expect to see characters/information/plot elements turn up in the forthcoming movie? (And, if they do, was it really an original idea of Zahn's, or something he was paid to include?) And do these works become part of the overall canon mythology of a creative work, if they're not written by the original author(s)? Or are they just glorified, officially sanctioned fanfiction? I'm sure Lee Goldberg would have his own ideas, but I wanted to hear yours.

[Poll #1388685]

For the record, I'm not talking here about "The Story of the Movie!" books here; I'm talking about character-driven novels such as Splinter of the Mind's Eye (an excellent book that I am happy to consider Star Wars canon). Does quality have a part to play in this as well?

Comments

[rhiannon76.livejournal.com]

Oh my goodness, I had Splinter of the Mind's Eye when I was little! Good book. I'd totally forgotten about it.

[retsuko.livejournal.com]

Yeah, it's a great book. To me, it's one of the reasons that I love fanfiction today: it fills in gaps left in the story, whether they're character- or time-driven. Splinter was both. :)

[lady-of-mists.livejournal.com]

As for the first question, I'd have to answer that I consider it a combination of all of the above. If I like what the author has done with the characters and it fits with the plot, I consider it to be canon. (Timothy Zahn's first three novels from the Star Wars universe were WONDERFUL and are well-worn from my childhood. I mean there was hot cocoa in it!) If I like some of what the author has done, but disagree with other parts, I vote for glorified fan-fiction... especially if love interests are added to the mix that were not members of the original cast and don't seem to fit with the characters, etc. If I read it and want to scrub my eyes out, I consider it to be a laughable example of bad writing. I've run into a couple of those in Star Wars novelizations -- but I've blocked out the titles and I'm afraid that I would mix the book up with something that was a Really Good Book if I named it.

For the second question, I love a good continuation of a story -- whether I'm doing it (yeah, I do have some hubris) or someone else is doing it. The key word here is good. I think that fanfic can be just as good as a sanctioned novel (and sometimes better because it's not written for profit, more for the love of the game, so to speak). It also allows for vignettes that you would not be able to assemble into a mass-market book.

[retsuko.livejournal.com]

I agree on the love-interests thing. I often wonder just how much say the authors get in the works, and if they create weird 'ships as a passive-aggressive revenge.

Where does canon end and fanon begin, in your opinion?

[lady-of-mists.livejournal.com]

:grins: I could definitely see some authors looking at a new love interest and saying, "You know, I've never seen this, but apparently someone has. Now it's stuck in my head and I've got to get it out somehow. I approve it!" I've actually had it happen with some of my characters -- where one person had a decided preference for a pairing that I wasn't entirely sure about.

I think that canon starts with author approval and shades down to things that make sense in a novelization and that do not conflict with the original novel. I also believe that things that were canon in a novelization can be overridden by the author should they release another movie, book, etc. Fanon starts with a purely derivative work that doesn't have author approval and shades up to a good work (sometimes with author approval) that totally changes a basic element of the plot, a part of the characterization, etc.

I don't know that it makes sense, but for example. The first Zahn trilogy to me is canon. Lucas let Timothy Zahn play in his world and make up a few of his own characters as a supporting cast. Thus we got Mara Jade (who is awesome in those books in my opinion) and Talon Karrde. Lucas didn't invent those characters, but he approved of them. Their interactions with the lead characters enhanced your view of the leads, but didn't take over entirely from the storyline that was already set forth. You have author approval, but additionally you have elements in there that were good in the novelization and didn't detract from or change major plot points in the original work.

On the other hand, you have fanon -- which is like my fanfic of The Phantom of the Opera. I didn't have approval from Gaston Leroux or Andrew Lloyd Webber. However, I like to think that my take on the characters (while it took a lot of liberties -- Raoul became a drunk, the Phantom was a bit more sane, Christine goes back to the stage, one added character) was one that merely tweaked the source material instead of twisting it around completely to my purposes.

So I guess I would have to say that I would accept something not from the original author as canon if they were careful to consult the original author (or his/her estate) and it blended with the past in an almost seamless manner.

[digitalemur.livejournal.com]

TV and movie properties have had varying approaches to how tightly to canon written spin-off works should hew. George Lucas kept the lid pretty tightly on such stuff for Star Wars, which is why there weren't really any spin-off books but Splinter until they then hired Zahn to write a canon 3rd trilogy and realized how much money could be made off such books. Then they turned lots of other people loose in the universe and went to town with it. Back then, having limited access to information about my fandoms, I was pretty picky and wanted to avoid things that would do a crappy job with them. Now that I have high-speed internet at home? I pick things up, read them as long as they're interesting, and sorta care about canon but am amused by its fluidity.

Gene Roddenberry, by comparison, was pretty damn laissez-faire about this stuff, and I always enjoyed that, even while I wanted my Star Wars to remain more pure. Go figure.

[retsuko.livejournal.com]

I pick things up, read them as long as they're interesting, and sorta care about canon but am amused by its fluidity.

I feel this way muchly about the Who/Torchwood universe. It seems like the writers get almost free reign in what they write in the official spin-offs, and I usually judge the books on their literary merits, rather than treating them like fanfiction (which I usually judge on its similarities to the show first, its literary value second).

[the_rck]

My attitude toward spin-off novels varies a lot. Basically, I'll treat things as canon if I like them and think they make sense with the primary canon.

Part of it is that some of these fandoms are so sprawling that nobody can follow all the details. That means that everybody has to do some picking and choosing. Part of it is that I've wandered through fandoms where pieces of canon actively contradict each other (anime continuity versus manga continuity or any long running superhero fandom). In those cases, all fans have to choose what to accept.

I tend to think that 'canon' is fluid once a particular source becomes very popular. For some fandoms, at least those that endure, decades from now, some fanfic may end up being seen as part of the canon in as much as it will be a part of what everybody knows about the overall story or of what people need to know in order to understand how people interact with the story.

[retsuko.livejournal.com]

I tend to think that 'canon' is fluid once a particular source becomes very popular. For some fandoms, at least those that endure, decades from now, some fanfic may end up being seen as part of the canon in as much as it will be a part of what everybody knows about the overall story or of what people need to know in order to understand how people interact with the story.

I agree with you on this wholeheartedly, but I cannot think of an example where this is true...